Chat with Silo, Mendoza, April 3, 2003

Chat with Silo
April 3, 2003, Mendoza
Version 1.1

This is an informal conversation that contains some significant commentaries which I believe may be of interest. Tito

Question No. 1: I wanted to ask – in the latest material on inner religiousness (RI – El Mensaje de Silo inspira una profunda religiosidad), the theme of “accumulation of unitive acts” is mentioned again, it is noted as a constant, correct? This is a key point, right?

Answer: In effect, it is always a constant, the theme of coherence. It couldn’t be otherwise. It is expounded on in many places, in the Inner Look it is repeated. We always allude to the topic that there are things that unify and other things that disunify, things that agglutinate and things that disperse (with a gesture of the hand closing and opening). But besides this there is the tendency (with a gesture of the hand moving upwards).

Question: The tendency? Yes, toward the more intelligent, to greater comprehension…

Comment: Toward the more conscious?

Answer: Of course, because if coherence were something linear, it would be alright; but it isn’t enough – what is interesting is the unitive in a growing direction. In moving toward more.

Question 2: Ever since the Message was launched I see that it is something totally apart, but I see it as important to practice the things proposed there. In the Council at least it is of the highest interest to practice it from time to time, meetings, studies of The Path, etc. – is this ok? Can this be done? I see that it is the best way to give a certain clear mystique to our work.

Answer: Of course it can be done, everything can be done, it helps. But it isn’t thought of [intended] for the Movement, which has its dynamic, its guidelines, forms, etc. Otherwise people wouldn’t understand each other, then if we present it there, in that ambit, somehow it would be kind of impositive, and that would not be good. We already commented on that in the Declaration in Mexico (with that of “It is not courageous to refrain from declaring one’s own certainties, but it is unworthy of true solidarity to try to impose them.” ). There everything has been said from a long way back, what we were going to do, said in that special way, not said with Steps 1, 2, 3, etc., but in “that manner.” What’s important is that it says, on one hand, “it is not good to impose, etc.”, and on the other, it says that of “it is not courageous to refrain from what I believe.” Thus we do this: ‘we say what we believe about these things,’ but in a separate place. That is, we already foresaw it enough time before, many years ago already…

Because people come to the Movement from many places and with diverse interests, obviously (from the organisms, from many and various activities, etc., and with their expectations), such that once people are there, we can’t come out with this, it would be somehow inappropriate…

Thus we say it outside that ambit (the Movement), to people. On the other hand, we couldn’t remain silent, obviously, just because someone doesn’t want to be disturbed by our things, we aren’t going to shut up – that would be the limit!
Question 3: In that same latest document, that one of the Inner Religiousness, it is said that its practice has to do with ‘the commitments of the Ceremony of Recognition,’ such that I see it is vital to study and practice it – can it be performed with that aim?

Answer: Certainly, that ceremony is pretty heavy, it carries a lot of things and, in effect, it marks what is of interest when one enters. It is of the greatest interest, above all for those who are into that.

Comment: He also clarifies the matter of Silo.net as the site for the “bona fide” materials, where everything is found without any flashiness – ‘we don’t want to dazzle the fools with little buttons, little lights, etc. – we don’t want fools! What is reliable is found there, and so if anyone has doubts about which material is good and which isn’t, well they have to stick with what it says there. Neither does one have to be concerned about whether it is published or not; what’s important is that it’s available there, people download it and it’s at hand.

There are some short videos there too, with low resolution so that they won’t be heavy for those who want to download them, that illustrate ceremonies or aspects of interest.

But later on we will put up some 10 minute videos with explanations on diverse things, they will be higher resolution so that they can been seen and heard clearly (since broadband technology is already widely diffused etc., there won’t be any problem).

He reiterates that this website is bona fide – we have seen all kinds of things, alterations, transpositions, changes, etc., so that is where the bona fide stuff is if people want a clear reference, and up to date, that’s where it is. A change was made from blue (a kind of sleepy hue) to purple, a velvety type. Not much more. No loud colors or attention-getting gimmicks – please?!?

Question 4: Then all that we will keep talking about, for ex., Texts for Future Complete Works, will always be about that thematic of The Message, the RI…?

Answer: Absolutely! Clear on that. About the Message. And everything is fine, it’s perfect, we are in no hurry at all, we’ve all the time in the world. The signals have already been placed in diverse areas, and that is moving along, they can’t stop it now. It is moving in a “gaseous” way, in a different manner, it isn’t like what is familiar in the Movement, with guidelines, calendars, etc., this goes in a different mode.

It has to do with “the profound,” with that which is profound in oneself; that is, with the profound in the landscape of representation. There are those who say that it would be obtained with the ‘elimination of the I’ (?), something that, if it could be done – which it can’t be, on the other hand – you are left with nothing, and if even your sphincter loosens up and you sh-- … so no, it isn’t like that. They say tremendous phrases like, ‘Kill the I’ or the ‘Ego’ (he pronounces it with an Indian accent), but it isn’t like that, it isn’t that way at all… The I has to do with the coordination of actions in connection with the world, with daily life, with the environment and with the body. It coordinates all those operations through internal representations of that type, it connects the body and the environment, and for this reason one has a very superficial register of its activity, this is why one doesn’t profundicize habitually, it is necessary to do other things and then yes, one can arrive at the profound (he clarifies: the profound in the space of representation).

There are many cases, in different places and cultures, that make contact, that hit there, in The Profound, and later they don’t know when, how or where, or how much time, etc. That is, ‘there there is no time or space.’ And so when they relate it, they only do so from memory, from remembrance; that is, they mention what they remember (not the phenomenon in itself) and then they already place other contents, for this reason they are somewhat imprecise in their narrations and with a lot of epochal contents from their own mythology. They add many decorations later, but the touching of the profound has been made. The mystics of different moments and places have touched there, in that profoundness, and later they’ve had the problem of how to expound on it, for ex., the Buddhists speak of ‘the nothing,’ of that ‘nirvana like nothing’ because, since there is no time or space, they believe there is nothing; but it isn’t like that, it isn’t that there is nothing… it is the profound, without time or space. That profound of the space of representation. Aside from this there are those who, without knowing much, call that ambit without time or space, ‘the sacred’, without clarifying where is it? They believe it is outside, in diverse sites, in places, and nonetheless it is in the profound.

Well then, we are emplaced there, in a profound ambit without time or space, without hurry and everything is perfect.

He comments besides: Outside things are growing more and more complicated. Everything is awry, all as a result of applying those models of ‘practicality, pragmatics,’ – therefore in that way things go badly for them, everything is bad and getting worse and worse. Everything is falling apart, it continues to fall apart, some time still has to pass before the collapse of the system, everything has begun to fall for some time already and it will continue. Heavy consequences are already noticeable, such as the destruction of expectation, etc., that is already being produced. And in a very accelerated way besides. This generation is seeing it, an individual can see it.

Before, this couldn’t be seen at one and the same time. They would say tell about a great-grandfather who said something, but they had little hope of continuing to live, nor did they ever see it; and afterwards that came true somehow; but now they can see it alright, and one learns about many things, about a broad space of time, everything contracts and accelerates.

Many things happen, the word one hears most often is: ‘Incredible!’ – but it may be so for you, however to me it is totally credible, and even more, it is even foreseeable… one has to look at things well, one sees things that are enchained.

What is happening is that what occurs ‘is not digestible,’ it is not easily integratable. ‘Ah! – that other thing.’ But how can it not be credible, if it is the consequence of that bizarre model, etc.

Question 5: In that field I always see the theme of: ‘the end of this and that,’ even among scientists, as though persisting in seeing ‘the end of the world, even of the Universe’ – what is that?

Answer: That is their projection, the projection of their nihilism, which they carry within and materialize outside. Things are carried by their process, they begin and they end, but for other reasons.

Here he clarifies that: These people and those who are destroying everything can only change, can only move on to something else, if by some chance they were to perform ‘a kind of triple somersault in their consciousness and they repented!’ (with an emphatic gesture of bringing his hands together) – it is that thing of: Repent! Then they will be able to move on to something different – but they won’t do it! Confound it!

But since they are moving in that twisted direction, they make such a huge effort ‘believing in that’ direction, that they end up that way, ‘ending, above all with themselves and it’s fine, because that is what they want. Strictly speaking, everything is according to ‘what one wants, what one believes,’ and things go there, in that direction.

One must see the model that is operating in the background and it is leading to a sure mess.

We propose another model, that of coherence, of the profound, etc., as we believe it, and ‘that is like that,’ ‘things are like this,’ as we say, no more and no less… ‘it is like this.’ And if it isn’t, they should look at how things are going for them, those smart guys…

In effect, everything is collapsing, and that is globalization, the real one, not the digitalized globalization that they believe in – it is like globalizing, but from a central point that is continuing just as it is and the rest is changing – it has inside it a colonial model, that comes from the 17th century, imagine!! And it isn’t like that. Globalization is such because all the points influence all the others, no part of the system is left out. Globalization is, besides, for good or ill, it is from and in all places; it does not happen for the convenience of some and the disadvantage of others. With its principal, secondary and all other effects, but it is moving…

It is in fact moving…. Just as we said it would.

He adds: On the other hand, ‘a new civilization is arising.’ It isn’t visible yet, one cannot visualize it still, like everything new that is arising, but there it is, it’s beginning…

Question 6: Another interesting point is the brief document of the RI that is that thing of ‘the dissolution,’ after death. We have seen commentaries when people resist considering that, as though they wanted ‘to continue’ even if in hell...

Answer: No, it isn’t like that – one goes toward dissolution, one dissolves and that’s it. Nothing of hells and weird things…but of course there are cultural inertias.

Strictly speaking, ‘what one believe will happen, happens.’ If one believes one thing, well that’s what happens.

If one believes that there is nothing, that everything ends, etc., well then that is what will happen, one dissolves and that’s it (but nothing like hells, etc.). But if one believes that one can go on, that there are gods, other planes and many things, well, that will happen… What one believes happens is what will happen. But what can NOT be, is that one believes in one direction and what happens to one is something from another direction – that is not so, that of following in one given direction and later another direction happens to one – no, that can’t be.

Other commentaries: At another point he returned to the theme of what happens in the environment and he pointed out the topic of ‘the leaders and the people,’ who separate more and more, because ‘they have different interests’ – I say ‘interests’ because said thus it is understood better. Leaders move along with their things, their problems, and they have nothing to do with daily life, with people’s preoccupations and then they start to give an angle to things…and then they can no longer be understood.

Things will become worse, ‘it won’t be long before people start stabbing each other’ because of the tensión that exists. It isn’t that a country will assault another country – this is now, later it will be another, and another. No, I mean people will no longer tolerate each other and it’s going to be an awful mess. He commented that many cases of domestic violence each week, and he says that that’s nothing, it’s the beginning…

I mention to him that in the environment there are two or three things that constantly take place. One is the deaths – every once in awhile someone dies, someone close, and it was unexpected, at different ages, it’s very common.

Answer 7: Yes, in effect, and more and more. It is a direct consequence of the big mess that exists…no doubt.

Another theme is superstition. Every five minutes there is a proper thinking person who signs up in a new superstition and they talk to you very seriously about, for ex., ‘the Mayan calendar, about this and that.’

Oh yes, that is the ‘supérstite’ [Definition in Diccionario Cuyás is: ‘adj. (leg.) surviving’] and it is spreading more and more, we already said that clearly at one time.

And later there are the ones who talk about those things, that seem to have to do with something similar to our works...

And, that’s something else – they’re the astute ones. That’s different, they see this motherlode and they sign up, but ‘because it sells,’ and only because of this.

It is nothing more than that, it isn’t that they profundicize, etc., but only ‘because it sells.’

He commented: That simple. The reduction of the phenomenon.

And so, with scripts: ‘because-saleable.’ Moreover, anyone can do it, they pick 20 words that sell and you put together a story. It doesn’t matter in what order, as long as they are 20 words that sell, and they string them together in writing, more-or-less, and voilà: that-sells.

For ex., ‘if you do this or that, you’ll be happy,’ that is a word that sells. Then those astute guys go and sell. And the fools who believe and put on a happy face even if inside they’re all in pieces…

Comment: There are also those who are, or who want to be, like connoiseurs or erudites and they talk about ‘elevated themes,’ etc., and one can see that they know nothing but they talk and talk.

Answer 8: Ah but that’s something else, those huís cull things from everywhere, they put things back together from here and there and they present them, they launch something, almost for the same reason: because-saleable. But that isn’t alright because they create a disaster in the environment and they confuse people. Those charlatans don’t understand, they experience nothing, but sure, it isn’t in their interest, what’s of interest is that other thing.

Question: In RI also it calls attention, that of ‘Faith is not necessary’ – it would seem that in the ambit of the religious there is always faith involved….

Answer 9: No, of course, here too what matters ‘is the evidence,’ ‘the evidence of the register’ – with that one advances.

Comment: And there is also talk about the importance of the Force.

Answer 10: Of course, the Force, always the Force, it is fundamental, its register, its consequences. That document is short, it isn’t even two pages in length and it says much, but they are kind of commentaries on what is said in the principal document. From the book The Message, complementing this principal text, as it were.
Question: Right, a propos, there it comments also about ‘the matter of the double and the spirit…’

Answer 11: That’s true, but that ‘is the explanation,’ that is what is explained about the theme, but one isn’t immersed in that every day, one isn’t worried about that on a daily basis, one is in that of the unitive acts, coherence, in those things – that other is the explanation.

Miscellanea

Later there was a brief reference to the múltiple activities of the Movement. And various positive comments were made, to which he added that ‘there is more intelligence in the Movement now.’

The dinner held the other time in Hile and Buenos Aires were mentioned as very important, he also asked about the upcoming country elections and the activities were mentioned, the different campaigns of Spain and Argentina, etc., briefly. Later, without going into depth, he turned back to the web site where there are many materials, including materials of diffusion (which is that of the Assembly).

He comments with interest that the Complete Works VII in English will be ready in a couple of months. It has been an important work (he commented that we are finishing Psychology I, II and III, we will hurry then). He emphasizes that it is of interest, that perhaps it doesn’t have big problems of translation, it is like a compilation of notes, it’s more simple, not like the poetic text of Humanize the Earth, the Inner Look, etc., whose translations have been a big deal…!

Comment: Yes, sure, because it seems simple, it doesn’t use complicated poetic words, but the meaning is key, and external translators don’t experience those things…

Right, it’s an entire work.

It will be put up in this web site and also the Italian version is almost ready (I don’t know yet about other important languages).

The Italian version is contemplated within a short time.

I comment to him again on the scientists and their things and of the news about a microorganism that is inferior to bacteria, that was discovered not long ago, and it’s a good example of ‘the psychism as a function of life’ because it releases a spore for a couple of hours, which searches for the best place for that individual, and installs itself there, and later what we could call the main body arrives. An example of those mechanisms that are so basic.

Answer: That thing you describe must be a virus. Viruses are the primary microorganisms, they can be latent for the longest time until they develop and there are extremely many of them. This is what makes them lethal, that there are so many of them. That’s the problem. For ex., they get into an elephant and in the long run they kill him because there are so many of them. If there were just one or two it wouldn’t matter, but they are very many, then they annihilate him, but they also kill themselves. This is what I see with these things of the viruses, the cancers, etc. That it isn’t that ‘they get what they want,’ – it isn’t ‘a triumphant song’; no, they also annihilate themselves, they annihilate the body that they are in, but they also are done with. Oh well, it’s another way of looking at it.

The Ecology Thing

It isn’t so strong anymore, it has declined, but there are those who say, we have to follow nature ‘because she’s wise’ – that everything bad is produced by man, etc.

“Oh really?” he says. “So if Nature is so perfect, how is it that she produced this gentleman who is so destructive?”

No, it isn’t like that. It could be said that Nature is perfect, but since ‘evil’ exists, that taints everything, then things turn out the way they turn out…but that isn’t right either, it’s total Manicheism.

He added that one hears more and more these days about “social ecology” – which you couldn’t find a single person who was into it before.

Already at the end of the talk, he repeats the stuff about “emplace yourselves in the profound, without time or space...’ He emphasizes, with amiability and a certain firmness, that: “So good, we are fine, everything’s fine; good, until another moment. Yes. Until next time. Thank you Negro, thank you very much.

It’s already late afternoon, like any day, somewhat cloudy, where one notes a great luminosity...


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